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NIKI LAUDA says F1 will lose fans if there continues to be different Grand Prix winners
Oxford Girl (IP Logged)
29 May, 2012 21:54
[www.thesun.co.uk]

I think it is great to see new winners in F1 makes it more exciting. They are all there for one reason and that is to race and Win.

What do you think?

 
Re: NIKI LAUDA says F1 will lose fans if there continues to be different Grand Prix winners
ronald.paloschi (IP Logged)
29 May, 2012 22:15
I think it is a total bullshit! This year so far has been the best champioship in a very long time.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 30/05/2012 20:47 by ronald.paloschi.

 
Re: NIKI LAUDA says F1 will lose fans if there continues to be different Grand Prix winners
K1 (IP Logged)
29 May, 2012 22:23
i fully acknowledge your comment oxford girl but the opposite is true and that is what irks me. you state that the reason that they are all there is 'to race and win'. that's the whole point....'they can't race' by their own admission. they cannot push their cars to the limit because of the limiting factors imposed on them by rubbish tyres. just my opinion.

 
Re: NIKI LAUDA says F1 will lose fans if there continues to be different Grand Prix winners
J4ck (IP Logged)
29 May, 2012 22:40
lauda is known for his stupid sentences

 
Re: NIKI LAUDA says F1 will lose fans if there continues to be different Grand Prix winners
j-s (IP Logged)
29 May, 2012 23:36
I think it's a lot of fun, especially when Williams is on the list of winners.

Every race is exactly the same as any other, it's just that the factors that contribute to performance have changed. The smartest teams will still win. They push to the limit set by the regulations and tires. So what if they conserve their tires, they've always done that.

Perhaps the thing that's a bit jarring is that they will hold back a bit, but they do that at their own risk as others might have fresher sets and overtake them. I think it's a lot of fun. A few years ago it was about the amount of fuel they had, and cars would overtake each other simply because they had less fuel. I don't see the current situation as conceptually different from that.

OK rant over. Feel free to dissect, K1.

 
Re: NIKI LAUDA says F1 will lose fans if there continues to be different Grand Prix winners
CLOVERLEAF 888 (IP Logged)
30 May, 2012 00:28
dont agree k1. i think the tyres make it very interesting.

i hated the indestructable bridgestones... the ones that seemed to be made for the ferraris.

pushing the cars to the limit cant be everything. we need stradegy and thats what the pirellis give us.

As for lauda... i find a lot of his ideas and comments strange at the best of times.

 
Re: NIKI LAUDA says F1 will lose fans if there continues to be different Grand Prix winners
Ozzy Osbone (IP Logged)
30 May, 2012 00:44
We always talk of the late 80s as the golden age of f1. That was the same as it is now.

That's all.

 
Re: NIKI LAUDA says F1 will lose fans if there continues to be different Grand Prix winners
K1 (IP Logged)
30 May, 2012 02:37
as i have said many many times....i don't wish the '80's back at all. F1 has both KERS and DRS to help prosecute passing manoeuvres so that takes car of that.

what i object to is that drivers cannot race to their full capacity as the limits of the tyres are set too low. yes, drivers have always had to take tyre wear into consideration but not to the same extent as they have to as a result of pre programmed destruction/degradation.

the F1 'world' seems to be in a flux with some for and some against so it is not just K1 saying this. tyres should not be the virtual differentiator. F1 racing is more than tyres, it should be about the total package..including the driver. i want to see the very best drivers in the very best cars fighting it out tooth and nail on track. drivers have said so many times that they don't attack as that will destroy the tyres so they revert to playing the % game. to me that is not F1.

J-S over to you to destroy hahaha

 
Re: NIKI LAUDA says F1 will lose fans if there continues to be different Grand Prix winners
j-s (IP Logged)
30 May, 2012 04:20
They're not driving balls out sometimes, true, but it's still awesomely entertaining from the perspective of competition. And if it results in some odd winners every now and then, like Webber, then all the better!

 
Re: NIKI LAUDA says F1 will lose fans if there continues to be different Grand Prix winners
K1 (IP Logged)
30 May, 2012 04:42
for some people yes, it is entertaining. for me it is too much 'hit and miss'.

look at quali for example. in monaco we had the current world champion choosing not to do a timed lap so that he could preserve a set of tyres and then manipulate what tyres he would start the race with?

that is, to me, unacceptable and it is not F1 racing. even the powers to be are saying the same thing and they are the very ones that wrote the current rules.

strategy and tactics have always been part of F1 but today they are the prime consideration rather than on track fights for ultimate supremacy. the average non addictive fan would be hard pressed to know what was going on when the winner of one race in a no name the next!!!

yes, i can drive my car, currently on pirellis, and get 50000kms on them if i choose to run at 50kph, but if i run them at street legal speeds i will get 25000kms, but it will be far more enjoyable.

 
Re: NIKI LAUDA says F1 will lose fans if there continues to be different Grand Prix winners
speed (IP Logged)
30 May, 2012 05:47
Quote:
K1
for some people yes, it is entertaining. for me it is too much 'hit and miss'.

Yes, if teams don't understand the tires or haven't figured out when they work and when they don't, it is going to be 'hit and miss'. So who'c job is it to understand what makes them work and what doesn't?

Quote:
K1
look at quali for example. in monaco we had the current world champion choosing not to do a timed lap so that he could preserve a set of tyres and then manipulate what tyres he would start the race with?

It was only the current WDC who didn't even try. All the others did. Also it goes to show that the real race is on Sunday and not Saturday. You can think of not qualify up the order and still challenge for the race win. Something which wasn't possible last year or the years before.

Quote:
K1
that is, to me, unacceptable and it is not F1 racing. even the powers to be are saying the same thing and they are the very ones that wrote the current rules.

Agree but it's only 1 driver yet and he did that at Spain too AFAIK. And on both occasions he wasn't on the podium so maybe they will change their strategy.

Quote:
K1
strategy and tactics have always been part of F1 but today they are the prime consideration rather than on track fights for ultimate supremacy.

Disagree. Today you can think about overtaking on the track on Sunday. Previously, qualifying was of supreme importance because overtaking on track was nearly impossible. Thus, strategy was the next most important thing. During the days of refueling, all the action was around pit-stops. You could watch a few laps at the start and around pit-stops and you would get all the action/information of the race. Things are far different today (though Monaco was still a bore).



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 30/05/2012 05:50 by speed.

 
Re: NIKI LAUDA says F1 will lose fans if there continues to be different Grand Prix winners
solus (IP Logged)
30 May, 2012 06:11
send him to the hell for the second time

 
Re: NIKI LAUDA says F1 will lose fans if there continues to be different Grand Prix winners
K1 (IP Logged)
30 May, 2012 10:02
we are seeing this from oblique angles speed. correct me if i am wrong but three teams didn't run in Q3 at barca.

i suggest you read the BBC column by webber and try to understand what he is saying re the tyres.

as i have said before KERS and the DRS are enough for passing to take place. the 'artificiality' introduced with pre programmed degradation of the tyres is a step too far. why do you think it is such a hot topic of discussion if it was universally acceptable?

people are saying that the teams must and will sort it all out and then it will be all okay dokey. that simply is not happening. the very best brains in F1 cannot come to grips with this problem otherwise they already would have.

anyway it has all become too fragmented and i hope that they make some adjustments to enable the teams to run and race on merit as it doesn't seem to be happening at the moment.

 
Re: NIKI LAUDA says F1 will lose fans if there continues to be different Grand Prix winners
mayhemfunkster (IP Logged)
30 May, 2012 10:10
They all have the same tyres and the job is to get across the finish line before their rivals.

I really don't see the problem. It might annoy me if I were a driver but i'm not.

The teams are bing conservative with strategies too, so they bring it on themselves. Take Monaco as an example. If the tyres were that fragile then Seb could not have done that mammoth stint. I think it's a fashionable excuse for underperforming stakeholders.

F1 will lose "fanboys" who only support a team that is dominating, but the real fanbase will be happier that there is unpredictability.

After all, the tifosi was in my estimation more rabid when Ferrari weren't winning. They were committed.



mayhemlurker ;-)

 
Re: NIKI LAUDA says F1 will lose fans if there continues to be different Grand Prix winners
PastorCrashdonado (IP Logged)
30 May, 2012 10:41
Lauda is an idiot.

 
Re: NIKI LAUDA says F1 will lose fans if there continues to be different Grand Prix winners
Lurcher (IP Logged)
30 May, 2012 11:25
Here's a thought. Maybe it would be possible, at certain tracks like Monza, Spa and a few others, to supply only hard compound tyres that are certain to last half a race and have one mandatory pitstop any time during the race. This would allow drivers to push harder without fear of ruining their tyres and reward the driver/car combination that is purely the fastest. It would also test the cars durability far more than we are currently seeing and bring in a tactical element to engine and gearbox management where the best cars will use new parts to fight for the win, but lower order teams might use end-of-life components to save the best for tracks where they can be competitive.

 
Re: NIKI LAUDA says F1 will lose fans if there continues to be different Grand Prix winners
IndyAndy (IP Logged)
30 May, 2012 11:54
I've never cared for Lauda since he dismissed Mansell's two seasons in IndyCar as "lazy racing". angry smiley



http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e114/IndyAndy/sig_.jpg

 
Re: NIKI LAUDA says F1 will lose fans if there continues to be different Grand Prix winners
speed (IP Logged)
30 May, 2012 11:57
Quote:
K1
we are seeing this from oblique angles speed. correct me if i am wrong but three teams didn't run in Q3 at barca.
people are saying that the teams must and will sort it all out and then it will be all okay dokey. that simply is not happening. the very best brains in F1 cannot come to grips with this problem otherwise they already would have.

3!! That is ridiculous. I thought it was just Vettel. Maybe they should allow teams to change tires before the race or give an extra set.

But 3 months is not enough. That's just a feeling, nothing else. IMO, they would have either tackled this by August break or FIA will be forced to change tire options.

 
Re: NIKI LAUDA says F1 will lose fans if there continues to be different Grand Prix winners
K1 (IP Logged)
30 May, 2012 12:06
well MHF that may be your opinion but i see it differently. in my case i don't have 'a team'. i follow williams and i support webber as my driver of choice.

it just so happens that RBR have won two races but that does't say that they have the tyres worked out. i don't think that any team has the knowledge to be able to set their cars up consistently in a winning combination.

in my opinion the tyres should be a constant albeit across a range if that is what is desired. the fact is though that the tyres don't appear to have any constancy hence the drivers are not able to extract the max most times.

it's fine by me that there are other opinions that are equally valid to their proponents. i just think that there is enough artificiality without adding tyres to the list.

 
Re: NIKI LAUDA says F1 will lose fans if there continues to be different Grand Prix winners
crusty_bread (IP Logged)
30 May, 2012 13:24
This is where a lot on here disagree with you K1. Tyres ARE a constant, but teams are finding the variations of different tracks and different temperatures hard to handle. It will, no doubt, calm down, but in the meantime, the only lack of racing I observed so far this season was at Monaco, where the tyres were durable and therefore PREVENTED drivers from racing- ie, from overtaking, or expressing their latent pace.

But you are side-tracking. Lauda doesn't mention tyres as the reason for why he thinks people will be turned off. The reason he gives is because champions are not winning.

As a multiple champion he is seeing it from HIS perspective, ie- back in his day his fans were disappointed if he wasn't winning. But that misses the point entirely and is a very elitist, narrow-minded view.

When Schumacher was dominating, overall viewing figures fell. Ok- his fan base went from strength to strength, but at a cost to everyone elses along with the neutral fan. If a driver monopolises the wins, he monopolises the fans. If he then stops winning, he loses fans- but to other teams. Monopolising wins is unhealthy. Vettel's dominance last year has caused amnesia in my mind, despite enjoying seeing Vettel win.

What we have this season is the potential for ex-champions to lose fans to other teams, whilst delighting the neutral fan, and that is no-ones problem but theirs.

We watch a race with 24 competitors and if credit is dispersed amongst more drivers, then that is no bad thing in the grand scheme of things, as much as the likes of those who stand to lose out would argue otherwise.

Webber-fans or Schumacher fans may be turned off this season, but Williams/Sauber/Mercedes/Lotus fans havn't had it this good for years, as is reflected in the traffic on this forum.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 30/05/2012 13:29 by crusty_bread.

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