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Re: 2nd Test. 2019.
shriekback (IP Logged)
02 March, 2019 00:55
Quote:
Gwanni
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/kubica-williams-lost-another-day/4346180/
Kubica words more detail


Ok, there are clearly some things to feel bad about in what Robert and Paddy revealed about the final test session. The two main ones are that the team was unable to complete the compressed testing program it had designed for itself in the wake of last week's late start--leaving it with a less than complete understanding of the car in advance of Australia. The second is the lack of a proper race simulation for one of our drivers--one who has not driven a race in an F1 car in 8 years--costing him the opportunity to develop valuable confidence.

There is some cause to feel a bit better too, however: the lap times achieved today, which, if representative, would place the FW42 last on the grid to start the season--a perception that has fed into the extreme negativity that seems to pervade this board at times and even to yet more moaning about the loss of Adrian Newey (an event of more than 20 years ago!)--are in fact not representative.

Apparently, Robert was dragging around a very compromised car today--one so compromised that there was by later afternoon nothing more to be learned by running it any further. And yet, he was still only a second or so slower than the Racing Point car. Doubtlessly, Williams was not the only team working with a somewhat fatigued car today, but I doubt any of them were nearly so tired from a lack of replacement parts as was the Williams.

So, not ignoring the downside, the lack of competitive speed shown today does not necessarily indicate that the car is not fundamentally good and that it will not be competitive over the course of the season. In fact, I think what Robert said indicates the opposite. The failure to achieve proper long runs today would not be such a big deal if the car had some fundamental flaw like the FW41. Clearly, he thinks there is more speed to be pulled out of the FW42 and he was predictably unhappy that today's effort could not contribute as much to that effort as it might have done.

So, while the delayed start of testing may have some effect on the performance of the car over the first few races, we may still yet see a fast Williams on track this year.

 
Re: 2nd Test. 2019.
Williams-123 (IP Logged)
02 March, 2019 07:07
So that is testing done and dusted,...............Looks like both Williams will not make it through the first part of qualifying in Melbourne and they will probably finish the race around 18th position...(Sm17)(Sm17)(Sm17)(Sm17)

 
Re: 2nd Test. 2019.
Ozzy Osbone (IP Logged)
02 March, 2019 07:09
I think there is little to be known about the true pace of our car as we don't know how compromised it was. It appears that one more component failure would have ended our test so it makes sense that the drivers were being very cautious. At the end of the day, any running is worthwhile. Even if just for testing component wear / reliability etc.

The car is clearly a better concept that the 41 and should be faster. Hopefully it is also predictable which was of course the fundamental flaw with the 41 although I often wonder what an Alonso or Hamilton could have done is that car.

I just hope the team can get this shambles with parts and organisation sorted for the early part of the season and that we turn up in Aus with a complete car and plenty of spares.

At the end of the day we ended the test only 2 seconds shy of the very best that was with a very compromised car. So I feel more optimistic than I did at this time last year.

 
Re: 2nd Test. 2019.
erratic (IP Logged)
02 March, 2019 07:11
Quote:
shriekback
So, while the delayed start of testing may have some effect on the performance of the car over the first few races, we may still yet see a fast Williams on track this year.

And something to build upon for the following season.

Is there not talk of the technology sharing rules being adjusted for 2021 so that we don't end up with some teams building very little of the car themselves? Might benefit Williams more than other midfield teams.

 
Re: 2nd Test. 2019.
Vancha (IP Logged)
02 March, 2019 08:30
I prefer our parts to wear out than our rim explodes in a corner /Ferrari/, to attach the floor to the exhaust + 1-2 big crash /Red Bull/ or to produce two cars looking for a concept /Mercedes/.

If many cars stop on track in Australia like Barcelona test, we will score points.

 
Re: 2nd Test. 2019.
GPL (IP Logged)
02 March, 2019 08:33
Well we now know for sure we have a slow car again to start the season with and
from what i can read into what the team and Robert are saying there will be no
magic bullet anytime soon.

Any thoughts on why we still cannot produce a car with decent down force even with this
new design team in position, and yet all the other midfield teams seem to have no problem to
at least get good down force if not great like the top 3.

I cannot remember when we had a car with good down force seems like it could be 10 or more
years ago.

It seems it is going to be a boring slog again for us Williams fans and like last year
for me not worth watching my team bring up the rear or even outside the top
10 being lapped every race.

Again if we are not competitive it does not hold my interest.

It is a shame i was looking forward to George and Robert battle for good points
this season and also the new car looks the part to my untrained eyes.

We need a proven aero man or a new wizz kid on the block.

 
Re: 2nd Test. 2019.
Gwanni (IP Logged)
02 March, 2019 09:14
let us hope that as Robert said yesterday and Lowe, we had an non optimum car that could mean more time, this could simply means a few tenths or more. Who Knows? But lets us wait patiently for a fortnight and we can see a lot of questions being answered. Although I have moaned, I am pleased that at least we have something decent at our hands that maybe needs some polishing. Works in progress. Caution is a must.

 
Re: 2nd Test. 2019.
GPL (IP Logged)
02 March, 2019 09:35
I would not use the word decent yet but we have a car that from what the drivers say is predictable.

Wait for oz but when we get there and it is still slow all the people will say is they
have not had anytime to do anything wait 3 or 4 races to see where we are.

How many times have heard this.

Anyway the only thing that might cheer me up is if Red Bull can mix with the other 2 and
make it a 3 way fight.

I think our cars will remain at the back somewhere this season.

 
Re: 2nd Test. 2019.
shriekback (IP Logged)
02 March, 2019 09:42
Quote:
GPL
from what i can read into what the team and Robert are saying there will be no
magic bullet anytime soon.

I don't see how Robert in any way addressed such a prima facia silly hope -- "magic" bullet? The very term suggests that it is not worth taking seriously and I can't imagine Robert ever even began to entertain such an idea. One might as well put all of one's savings into the purchase of lottery tickets. Yes, people do actually win the lottery, and every couple of decades or so someone comes up with a double-diffuser or active suspension and rises from obscurity to take an unanticipated championship. If your interest depends on that occurring to you or your chosen team, however, odds are you are going to be bored and disappointed.

Quote:
GPL
Again if we are not competitive it does not hold my interest.

Ok, fair enough. It's good to be honest with yourself. You root for front-runners only. That's extremely unlikely to be Williams this year. Let me suggest you get behind Mercedes, Ferrari, or (if you are even a little bit of a gambler) Red Bull instead. That, or pick another sport entirely. Perhaps some years down the road, Williams will again justify your interest and you can rejoin the discussion as a genuine--albeit fair-weather--supporter.

Quote:
GPL
We need a proven aero man or a new wizz kid on the block.

Have you evaluated, from a genuinely informed perspective, the resumes of those that Frank and Claire (presumably with Paddy's input) have hired to do that job and determined that they are unproven amateurs? I strongly suspect not. I think you should reflect upon the fact that the competition have also hired very knowledgeable and talented people--likely the very cream of the crop of aerodynamicists in the world--to work for them too and that the difference between first and last in the competition they are engaged in is 2 or 3 seconds over several miles. We think of the FW41 as a terrible car. The truth is that it was able to go around a wildly twisty course in an incredibly short amount of time and that it was, by any objective measure, a fantastic machine. It just fell a few short seconds behind what nine other machines could cover that time in. (Oh, by the way, women can be aero experts as well.)

Formula 1 is an incredibly competitive endeavor and besting any competitor at all is a massive achievement. If the best efforts of a team of incredibly talented and devoted people engaged in that effort doesn't capture your interest, there is a world full of other ways to pass your short time on the planet.

For me, at least, following, supporting, and delighting in whatever success might come to one of the few remaining properly independent old-school F1 teams in this era of massive trans-national corporate involvement in the sport, justifies and richly rewards my attention. I can't wait for the real competition to start. As long as Williams is able to get after it and race, either at the back or at the front, I'll be along for the ride and having a great time.

 
Re: 2nd Test. 2019.
shriekback (IP Logged)
02 March, 2019 09:58
Quote:
erratic
Quote:
shriekback
So, while the delayed start of testing may have some effect on the performance of the car over the first few races, we may still yet see a fast Williams on track this year.

And something to build upon for the following season.

Is there not talk of the technology sharing rules being adjusted for 2021 so that we don't end up with some teams building very little of the car themselves? Might benefit Williams more than other midfield teams.

One can only hope that that is the direction taken by whatever new rules they end up settling on. At this point, all the top teams have an obvious incentive to operate a sort of "B" team--to keep up with each other. If that was ruled out in general, however, that incentive would be significantly diminished. It is true that they would then have to deal with independent teams like Williams and McLaren as more viable competitors. Let's hope, however, that they recognize that that would be really good for the sport overall and would only make whatever success they can achieve in it only that much more valuable and impressive.

In any case, if that does occur, I think Williams--since it has maintained a capacity to produce a complete car (excepting the PU) in-house--would certainly have a major leg up over teams like Haas, Torro Rosso, and Alpha Romeo.

 
Re: 2nd Test. 2019.
phatjack (IP Logged)
02 March, 2019 10:37
Good to see you posting again and well said.

 
Re: 2nd Test. 2019.
02 March, 2019 10:52
Shierkback couldn't gave written a better reply to all the doom and bloomers get behind the team and support then instead off slagging them off



100% Williams
WILL SUPPORT WILLIAMS AS LONG AS THEY HAVE A TEAM

 
Re: 2nd Test. 2019.
Stu69 (IP Logged)
02 March, 2019 10:57
Everyone can @#$%& and moan all they like, it won’t change anything! People need to try to find some positivity! You can’t turn back the clock to Adrian or Nigel. It’s 2019 guys and in a couple of weeks we go racing! What will be will be but I know one thing for sure..... everyone in Williams F1 will be trying their best to improve and do well and won’t be moaning on from the side lines causing disruption!

 
Re: 2nd Test. 2019.
02 March, 2019 11:02
I also follow Middlesbrough fc for my sins so i know about the high and lows



100% Williams
WILL SUPPORT WILLIAMS AS LONG AS THEY HAVE A TEAM

 
Re: 2nd Test. 2019.
Williams-123 (IP Logged)
02 March, 2019 11:57
Quote:
phatjack
Good to see you posting again and well said.

Hey phat are you talking to shriekback??? Who is shriekback??? Did they used to post under a different name???

 
Re: 2nd Test. 2019.
Williams-123 (IP Logged)
02 March, 2019 12:02
Some posters here seem to be sugar coating things,....You can sugar coat things as much as you want but the Williams Racing Team running around in 18th and 19th position just does not seem right.

I thought the great Williams Racing Team are in Formula 1 to win and not just to make up the numbers.

 
Re: 2nd Test. 2019.
andy si (IP Logged)
02 March, 2019 12:08
Quote:
ihme
Quote:
Mikef1
Quote:
ihme
So Mike, had we started testing on the day 1 last week, would we be out of running for the last 3 days of the 2nd test anyway?
edit: or it wouldnt happen because we would not compress our running so much and we would do less mileage each day?

Well if the team had hit the track on Monday it would have had a whole week to bring the spare parts which is achievable. So on say Wednesday the car on track would have had fresh suspension, wing etc etc. If they didn't have spare components then yes the car wouldn't be on track any more beyond Wednesday.


Interesting in Paddys statement that the wear on the components was enough to impact Russells runs too. I am ever an optimist and that suggests there are tenths to find just in optimal car parts alone.

I also had a chat with a guy who suggested that Williams' rear wing end plates were rushed out of the factory and not representative of what would be run in Australia because it would take days to add the additional aero they probably have planned in that area. Now this guy knows nothing inside info wise but his theory is sound and certainly a very likely scenario.

Yeah I always thought our rear wing looked fairly primitive.

I think Williams have a good starting point to hit midfield and mess with regular points. Specially with the prospect of potential performance gain from setup work.
The late in the day car finish scenario showed in parts available.. not totally unexpected TBH with the late car build.

But most important.. data analysis and preparation of enough Melbourne spec parts to go racing now.

Most important for Williams.. solid reliability from the word go. This can pump them up and us for that matter, that whatever parts they bring forward to go racing will be solid.
Still to see, regarding the work the team did, what parts they do develop further and upgrade first with the track analysis made and understood -> to make the thing go fast(er)!

I'm always the glass half full kind of guy!
Maybe now more than ever..

 
Re: 2nd Test. 2019.
phatjack (IP Logged)
02 March, 2019 12:23
Quote:
Williams-123
Quote:
phatjack
Good to see you posting again and well said.

Hey phat are you talking to shriekback??? Who is shriekback??? Did they used to post under a different name???

Yes, I was Whitey and if it's who I think it is I owe him an apology, he was right and I was wrong.

 
Re: 2nd Test. 2019.
02 March, 2019 13:01
Williams F1 is in our hearts our brains say support someone else but we don't as we know we are here to stay who ever drives for us or builds and designs the car as long as Williams is above the door that's who we support



100% Williams
WILL SUPPORT WILLIAMS AS LONG AS THEY HAVE A TEAM

 
Re: 2nd Test. 2019.
j-s (IP Logged)
02 March, 2019 14:29
I understand the calls to curb the negativity prevalent among many posters, including myself. I don't agree, but I know that reading negative stuff is exhausting. Especially for the glass-half-full guys.

I'm not critical of the pace itself. I'm critical of running a compromised, late, incomplete and worn out car. There are no silver linings to this. We can explain the sequence ad nauseam and it won't change the core issue: Williams is in deep trouble ATM. At least I think so.

Can the team improve? Of course. Will we see a better car in Melbourne? Definitely. Will it be better than the next best team? I doubt it. Maybe in time.

Cheers to all and let's hope for a good first race. At least seeing a car running without sacrifices.

Current Page: 40 of 42

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